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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;I want my white hat back&#8221; &#8212; military interrogators against torture</title>
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	<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/</link>
	<description>a citizen's journal by Thomas Nephew</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2012 23:25:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Ray Bennett</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1962</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Bennett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jun 2008 02:35:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1962</guid>
		<description>Paul, I will make it a point of honor to not let your father's faith in decent people die with him. It's from folks like him (and such as yourself) that I draw strength to tilt at a few more windmills. I am not alone in this, as evidenced by the meeting this week. It's going to be a long haul to set things right, but if folks truly love America, the ideals that it strives for (and I do acknowledge the stumbles along the way), if folks REALLY think this is the Land of the Free and the Home of the Brave, it's time to co-locate money and mouth... All the best to you and yours.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul, I will make it a point of honor to not let your father&#8217;s faith in decent people die with him. It&#8217;s from folks like him (and such as yourself) that I draw strength to tilt at a few more windmills. I am not alone in this, as evidenced by the meeting this week. It&#8217;s going to be a long haul to set things right, but if folks truly love America, the ideals that it strives for (and I do acknowledge the stumbles along the way), if folks REALLY think this is the Land of the Free and the Home of the Brave, it&#8217;s time to co-locate money and mouth&#8230; All the best to you and yours.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1958</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 23:17:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1958</guid>
		<description>My dad died about a year ago.  In the '60s, he'd been a naval aviator over Vietnam for three tours, flying A-4 Skyhawks off of carriers, same as McCain.  Before he died, we talked a lot about what had happened to our country over the past several years and how he felt about it.

You could pretty well sum up his feelings in that very evocative phrase: "I want my white hat back."  For him, that's what the United States was and had been - the guys in the white hats.  

Now, he was a life-long Republican (Rockefeller variety) and I'm a leftist, so I refrained from disquisitions on the dirty little wars we've engaged in over the years, but the bigger point was his absolute disgust that this Administration had dared to trash the good name of the U.S. and to put servicemen &#38; women in greater jeopardy should they fall into enemy hands.

He'd had no illusions about he would have been treated if he'd been shot down over Vietnam, but it was important to him to believe that *we weren't doing the same thing*.  

As more and more details about Gitmo and Abu Ghraib came out, he got more and more disgusted, even more than I was.  I think it was because he'd put his life literally on the line in defense of the ideals, and here they were being casually discarded by the likes of John Yoo, Donald Rumsfeld, et al.  

It did not escape his attention that none of the men so casually dismissing the importance or relevance of the Geneva Convention had ever served in harm's way, when it might have had more than abstract significance to them.

He would have been somewhat cheered if not surprised to find military men like you speaking with clarity and a unique moral authority against this criminal behavior.  I think for literally the first time in his life, he had actually been somewhat ashamed of the U.S. in the years before he died, but he harbored hope that decent people would eventually right the ship.  Thank you for proving him right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My dad died about a year ago.  In the &#8217;60s, he&#8217;d been a naval aviator over Vietnam for three tours, flying A-4 Skyhawks off of carriers, same as McCain.  Before he died, we talked a lot about what had happened to our country over the past several years and how he felt about it.</p>
<p>You could pretty well sum up his feelings in that very evocative phrase: &#8220;I want my white hat back.&#8221;  For him, that&#8217;s what the United States was and had been - the guys in the white hats.  </p>
<p>Now, he was a life-long Republican (Rockefeller variety) and I&#8217;m a leftist, so I refrained from disquisitions on the dirty little wars we&#8217;ve engaged in over the years, but the bigger point was his absolute disgust that this Administration had dared to trash the good name of the U.S. and to put servicemen &amp; women in greater jeopardy should they fall into enemy hands.</p>
<p>He&#8217;d had no illusions about he would have been treated if he&#8217;d been shot down over Vietnam, but it was important to him to believe that *we weren&#8217;t doing the same thing*.  </p>
<p>As more and more details about Gitmo and Abu Ghraib came out, he got more and more disgusted, even more than I was.  I think it was because he&#8217;d put his life literally on the line in defense of the ideals, and here they were being casually discarded by the likes of John Yoo, Donald Rumsfeld, et al.  </p>
<p>It did not escape his attention that none of the men so casually dismissing the importance or relevance of the Geneva Convention had ever served in harm&#8217;s way, when it might have had more than abstract significance to them.</p>
<p>He would have been somewhat cheered if not surprised to find military men like you speaking with clarity and a unique moral authority against this criminal behavior.  I think for literally the first time in his life, he had actually been somewhat ashamed of the U.S. in the years before he died, but he harbored hope that decent people would eventually right the ship.  Thank you for proving him right.</p>
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		<title>By: mick</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1952</link>
		<dc:creator>mick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:18:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1952</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I will gladly talk to anyone, for this reason: Why would I not answer to you, my fellow citizens, for as a soldier, everything I did, I did in your name. Clearly there are areas I cannot speak about, concerning individual cases and the classification issues that come with them. But I will gladly be held to account by you. That’s the way it should be.&lt;/i&gt;

Well, Mr Bennett, that isn't the attitude we've become used to over the last 7 years. There seem to be all sorts of reasons/excuses/justifications the Bush/Cheney Administration can find for not telling us &lt;i&gt;anything&lt;/i&gt;. It's a relief to hear someone speak normally again, as if what shouldn't be secret shouldn't be &lt;i&gt;kept&lt;/i&gt; secret. I appreciate it, and thank you. It was fascinating.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I will gladly talk to anyone, for this reason: Why would I not answer to you, my fellow citizens, for as a soldier, everything I did, I did in your name. Clearly there are areas I cannot speak about, concerning individual cases and the classification issues that come with them. But I will gladly be held to account by you. That’s the way it should be.</i></p>
<p>Well, Mr Bennett, that isn&#8217;t the attitude we&#8217;ve become used to over the last 7 years. There seem to be all sorts of reasons/excuses/justifications the Bush/Cheney Administration can find for not telling us <i>anything</i>. It&#8217;s a relief to hear someone speak normally again, as if what shouldn&#8217;t be secret shouldn&#8217;t be <i>kept</i> secret. I appreciate it, and thank you. It was fascinating.</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Bennett</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1950</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Bennett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 11:29:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1950</guid>
		<description>Hi Thomas and Bill. You're right, Bill, the distinction between "off the record" and "anonymous" is clear, and what we have here is clearly anonymous. I was the person that Thomas spoke to, and Ray is a pseudonym, which satisfies my standard. I wanted to comment on your remark "and persuaded him to talk to you". No persuasion necessary. I will gladly talk to anyone, for this reason:  Why would I not answer to you, my fellow citizens, for as a soldier, everything I did, I did in your name. Clearly there are areas I cannot speak about, concerning individual cases and the classification issues that come with them. But I will gladly be held to account by you. That's the way it should be.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Thomas and Bill. You&#8217;re right, Bill, the distinction between &#8220;off the record&#8221; and &#8220;anonymous&#8221; is clear, and what we have here is clearly anonymous. I was the person that Thomas spoke to, and Ray is a pseudonym, which satisfies my standard. I wanted to comment on your remark &#8220;and persuaded him to talk to you&#8221;. No persuasion necessary. I will gladly talk to anyone, for this reason:  Why would I not answer to you, my fellow citizens, for as a soldier, everything I did, I did in your name. Clearly there are areas I cannot speak about, concerning individual cases and the classification issues that come with them. But I will gladly be held to account by you. That&#8217;s the way it should be.</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Nephew</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1944</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Nephew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 04:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1944</guid>
		<description>You know, you're right.  At any rate, all of this was with his permission, and I also asked an HRF person whether I could report stuff on my blog as long as I didn't reveal names. I understood the HRF person to mean I could.  Maybe conversations weren't necessarily off the record in the correct sense you define, while "official event stuff" like one guy's comments to all of us was.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, you&#8217;re right.  At any rate, all of this was with his permission, and I also asked an HRF person whether I could report stuff on my blog as long as I didn&#8217;t reveal names. I understood the HRF person to mean I could.  Maybe conversations weren&#8217;t necessarily off the record in the correct sense you define, while &#8220;official event stuff&#8221; like one guy&#8217;s comments to all of us was.</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Day</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1943</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Day</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 04:33:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1943</guid>
		<description>Thomas, a very interesting couple of posts on your conversations with a former interrogator, illuminating on both the ineffectiveness and the illegality of torture.  I am really impressed that you found this interrogator and persuaded him to talk to you. One minor quibble: you might want to state that you guaranteed your source anonymity rather than stating that the conversation was "off the record," since that implies, presumably incorrectly, that you agreed not to report it at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thomas, a very interesting couple of posts on your conversations with a former interrogator, illuminating on both the ineffectiveness and the illegality of torture.  I am really impressed that you found this interrogator and persuaded him to talk to you. One minor quibble: you might want to state that you guaranteed your source anonymity rather than stating that the conversation was &#8220;off the record,&#8221; since that implies, presumably incorrectly, that you agreed not to report it at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Nephew</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1941</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Nephew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2008 03:24:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1941</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Ray, I appreciate that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Ray, I appreciate that.</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Bennett</title>
		<link>http://newsrackblog.com/2008/06/18/i-want-my-white-hat-back/#comment-1938</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Bennett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2008 23:25:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://newsrackblog.com/?p=2365#comment-1938</guid>
		<description>Thomas, a good post. One small note: "Human Rights First has brought together about twenty interrogators with significant military experience". Later on you mention FBI and CIA agents that were also present, which is not only accurate, but important. So the first line should read "with significant interrogation experience". Other than that, an excellent, objective, and informative post. All the best, Ray
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thomas, a good post. One small note: &#8220;Human Rights First has brought together about twenty interrogators with significant military experience&#8221;. Later on you mention FBI and CIA agents that were also present, which is not only accurate, but important. So the first line should read &#8220;with significant interrogation experience&#8221;. Other than that, an excellent, objective, and informative post. All the best, Ray</p>
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